• Kevin_in_MDKevin_in_MD Senior Member
    This one has merit

    "Open Water Task Force: Chris McGiffin went over the recommendations made by the BOD Open Water Task Force. In an effort to deal with the $1,000 insurance surcharge the Task Force has suggested we consider either assessing an equitable national sanction fee spread between pool and open water events or assess a surcharge fee for each USMS member during the registration process. An open water membership was rejected as not practical. The decision will be made in the House of Delegates."

    The sanction fees should be spread across the organization, that's kinda the purpose of insurance, spread the cost around so no one gets the shaft too bad.

    I THINK though that a motion in the house of delegates without the backing of the relevant committee is dead on arrival. Never been, but I get the impression that's how it goes.
  • FilFil Derby, VTCharter Member
    As to NEMS helping to cover sanctioning fees, they offered it last year to take the sting out of that particular issue on larger swims. I believe that's still on the table, this year. You'd have to ask them. A remaining issue up here is the sanctioning fee for smaller swims. I have swims with 10 swimmers, 25, and 50 swimmers. My own insurance takes into account the likely numbers. It averages $3 to $4 per participant, spread out over 40 to 50 days of events. On a 10 swimmer event, the cost to me is about $30 to $40.
  • wendyv34wendyv34 Vashon, WASenior Member
    Coach Bob Bruce briefly summarized the OW Committee meeting in the Nov/Dec Aquamaster . He gave a bit more detail than the minutes that are posted.

    Coach Bob does a fantastic job organizing OW events, year after year. The PNA (western WA LMSC) has been inspired by Bob's (& OMS) excellence to sanction 5 races in the Seattle area, including two in Puget Sound. One of the main reasons I'm a member of USMS is to participate in as many events as possible. The caliber of swimmers tends to be higher at the USMS events (PNA & OR, can't speak for any others) and I find swimming with a more skilled group to be more enjoyable than getting clobbered by a bunch of triathlete dudes in wetsuits.

    I registered my own open water team with USMS for 2015, Vashon Open Water Swimmers! We're going out for a swim around Blake Island on Tuesday!

    It's always a bad hair day when you work at a pool.

  • david_barradavid_barra NYCharter Member
    Following is the “meat” of Bob Bruce’s summary: items 1&2 are enough reasons for me to be disinterested in a USMS sanction.

    "The House of Delegates passed 66 long distance rules, a few of which were large, some substantive, but most aimed at reorganization and clarification to make the rulebook an easier, clearer, and more precise tool for everyone. As swimmers, I’ll bet that most of you will notice few of these changes at all! In my opinion, the four largest changes for open water swimming were (1) the introduction of water temperature limits (60 degrees minimum and 85 degrees maximum for all swims, with modification under certain circumstances); (2) the reintroduction of shoulder-to-ankle textile suits in open water only, for both men and women (I’ll write much more about this in the spring before the next open water season starts); (3) the outlawing of navigational aids generally and MP3 players specifically (wristwatches are still allowed); and (4) the presence of an Independent Safety Monitor appointed by the
    local LMSC to make sure that the stringent safety requirements are followed at each local sanctioned swim."

    ...anything worth doing is worth overdoing.

  • gregocgregoc Charter Member
    #1 will cause the exclusion of many cold water swims.
  • ChickenOSeaChickenOSea Charter Member
    #2 is bewildering
  • lcolettelcolette Charter Member
    I'm not a fan of number 1. I think that education, cold and warm water training are better answers.
    2 I'm pretty sure stems from the fact that long suits are allowed in FINA events. World Championships 3K long suits were allowed.
  • ChickenOSeaChickenOSea Charter Member
    I'm confused then. Didn't think USMS was the same as Fina?
  • lcolettelcolette Charter Member
    USMS reports to FINA (Fédération Internationale de Natation). FINA is the umbrella over most swim organizations that are in conjunction with the 'youth' swimming, 'National' teams and the only way to make the Olympics. USMS was lucky in that we grew up in parallel of USA Swimming.
    In many countries they are the same organization both youths and adults are overseen by FINA.
    There are exceptions such as British Long Distance Swimming Associate which is independent, Manhattan, Catalina, and the Channel groups are independants also.
  • lakespraylakespray Senior Member
    I've said this before but open water does not need USMS the question is, does USMS need open water? Even prior to the insurance fiasco the largest most successful open water events in USA like; La Jolla Roughwater, NYC swims, Great Chesapeake Bay Swim, most of the San Francisco bay events etc., have never been sanctioned by USMS. If USMS wants to be in open water then they need to be helpful not a hindrance at least for the last couple of years they have been a hindrance. They need to change there thinking, race promoters should be valued clients, therefor how can I help my client have a successful event so they will be a return client, recommend us to other potential race promoters and grow the sport.

    Regarding these two items:
    (1) the introduction of water temperature limits (60 degrees minimum and 85 degrees maximum for all swims, with modification under certain circumstances); (2) the reintroduction of shoulder-to-ankle textile suits in open water only, for both men and women
    I'm actually surprised USMS would go as low as 60 degrees. I'm not to worried they will lose potential events on this. Those of us that go under 60F are a sub genre of the sub genre, cold water swimming may be growing but were still a minuscule group. Interesting enough a USMS 10K championship I did in Noblesville, Indiana a few years back would have had to been canceled as it exceeded 85F. Wish I could have that one back, cramp city. Number 2 just put's USMS in line with FINA, which is far more important to them then being inline with the MSA. Personally fabric based neck to ankle suits don't really bother me that much. I think any assistance they offer is at best very minor and boost they do have may become a bit of a hindrance after a mile or so, as despite the water resistant coating they become a little water logged after about 20 minutes in.
  • wendyv34wendyv34 Vashon, WASenior Member
    It will be interesting to see what happens with sanctions for the two salt water races here in Puget Sound. The water is usually billed as "around 60" or "60-65". They have required wetsuits at some of those races, unless you get a waiver from the race director, (or they already know you). I can't recall any organized lake swims I've done in the PNW in the last 20 years as being significantly under 60 and definitely not over 85, but I'll take 59 over 86 any day.

    I'm not sure it's going to help increase participation if swimmers feel like they are risking losing entry fees and travel expenses because the water is a degree over or under the limits, causing the race to be cancelled. After losing $1K on Slam the Dam last year, (thanks govt. shutdown!), I'd be wary of sinking any cash into going to a race that has a fair chance of being cancelled (for any reason).

    I saw a few people wearing full body suits this year and heard that USMS has a waiver for people who have had skin cancer to wear full coverage suits. It didn't really look like an advantage, as the suits appeared waterlogged (baggy) at the finish.

    It's always a bad hair day when you work at a pool.

  • FilFil Derby, VTCharter Member
    Kingdom Swim will be a USMS sanctioned event in 2015 and 2016. The other swims we offer in 2015 will not be sanctioned. Good to hear that "fast suits" lose their "fast" after about a mile. We will follow USMS rules at Kingdom Swim in 2015 and 2016. The first place woodals, jerky and syrup will be awarded to the 1st place finishers in compliance with those rules. But, the coveted walking sticks will ONLY be awarded to those who follow traditional channel crossing rules. I doubt we will see a "fast suit" on the line at Kingdom Swim.
  • IronMikeIronMike BostonCharter Member

    Please join the Lake Issyk Kul Swimming Federation on FB!

  • IronMikeIronMike BostonCharter Member

    In light of @evmo's recent blog post, I'm commenting in this thread again. Any updates on USMS sanctioning? I've lost the ball on this issue as I'm out of country for a while.

    Please join the Lake Issyk Kul Swimming Federation on FB!

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