Questions and Notes on Open Water Butterfliers

SuddethBSuddethB Member
edited July 2020 in General Discussion

I'm doing some research on OW butterfliers, and I'm looking for input. You can see some of my output here:

I read a prior thread setting some guidance on stroke legality prior to Sylle's fly EC. (ref:
I also read a group document that came out of that discussion. (ref:

There is a minor conflict between parts of the discussion and the document, specifically in the allowed kick. The document is clear that dolphin kick is required and breaststroke whip kick is NOT (I concur with this.) Some parts of the discussion also recognize that some groups DO allow "butterfrog" kick (US Masters, WOWSA), but it would appear that isn't in line with FINA standards. (ref: 8.3

One of the things I'm looking to do is recognize Robin Lajoie of Canada who has several 10K OW swims in butterfly. I don't see his name in your longswims database. Is there a way to search the database by stroke so I can find more butterfly long OW swims?

I have information from Robin that he's completed the 10K "Welland Canal Open Water Swim" in Ontario three times (2012, 2014, 2018) all butterfly each time (FINA kick, no wetsuit). His most recent one was at the youthful age of 63 (born March 27, 1955). I had hoped to be able to swim a 10k fly at an age older than Dan Projansky to become the oldest marathon flyer, but Robin has me beat. I'm hoping someone can find the official results and we can get his swims into the DB.
I believe Robin has taken Danny off of this "record": link

but not off this one: link

On the youth side, I was pleased to see notes about Michaela Arsenault and her Lake Erie fly swim. Thanks for info about that and her sister Trinity.

Any information or links about other butterfly OW swims (no wetsuit, no butterfrog, all fly, 1 mile or more) is very welcome. You can reach me via

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